Seeking refuge from school violence
Wei Chen sits at the table, opens his backpack and unloads folders full of paperwork documenting alleged abuses against Asian immigrant students at South Philly High.
“Sometimes it’s the same student in many fights,” says Chen, pointing to a day planner that is full of Chinese writing, listing the troubles of each particular day.
“Some kids get picked on a lot.”
Dozens of the alleged incidents are relatively minor—name-calling, verbal threats, petty robberies, random punches in the head while walking down stairwells, and general intimidation. But according to Chen, at least six times last school year those minor incidents escalated into massive rumbles where outnumbered Asian students were pummeled by packs of teens, sending several of the victims to hospitals. Like the day last October when a group of around 30 kids allegedly attacked five Chinese students after school in the Snyder Avenue subway station, one block from school. That incident started when a black student walked up to a Chinese kid in the cafeteria, touched his hair and allegedly threw a carton of milk at him. Rumors of threats filtered through the school on the day after the subway rumble, and the notion of continued violence froze Asian students.
“That day, all the Chinese students were very scared,” says Chen, an 18-year old senior who formed the South Philadelphia High School Chinese-American Student Association in the days after the alleged subway attack. “Students avoided the lunch room. They were scared to walk home. They stayed in the ESOL (English for Speakers of Other Languages) department until their parents picked them up.”
Many Asian students continued living in fear for the remainder of the school year, even after one of the alleged subway assailants was identified on SEPTA cameras and transferred to another school. In a cry for help, scared students signed petitions, wrote letters, held meetings, staged a walkout and pleaded with school administrators to do something about the attacks.
But the violence at South Philly High, listed among the state’s “persistently dangerous schools” for the third consecutive year, continued.
The litany of abuses isn’t limited to South Philly High. Male and female Asian students—especially those new to the country, who speak little or fractured English—have been targeted over the past few years, in schools from the Northeast to South Philly, in elementary and high schools. Students and activists say that Chinese, Vietnamese, Cambodian, Pakistani and other Asian youth have been singled out, assaulted in cafeterias, hallways, on city streets, school buses and everywhere in between.
Kids say the violence has often been dismissed by school safety officers as well as administrators. “This is a cultural problem,” Wei Chen claims the former principal at South Philly told Asian students on the day after the subway rumble.
District officials acknowledge that some situations weren’t handled well, leaving many students feeling abandoned.
“There’s a lot of mistrust,” says comprehensive high school regional superintendent Michael Silverman. The impact of the violence on such vulnerable populations can have a major impact on their lives, activists say.
“We’ve heard of students not going to school—as young as 8th and 9th graders,” says Khin Mai Aung, a staff attorney with the Asian American Legal Defense and Education Fund (AALDEF).
“Some kids drop out. Others just become less involved and perform poorly. They can’t learn when they don’t feel safe.”
Where administrators or the School District intervened, improvements in student relations improved and the violence decreased—the number of overall violence in the district decreased by 17 percent last school year. But the culture of violence against Asian immigrants has existed for so long at some public schools that students almost accept that random beat downs are a part of life.
During the weeks prior to the subway rumble, there were numerous confrontations at South Philly High, according to student incident reports.
Eight students emptied the pockets and school bag of a Chinese student in the bathroom on Sept. 9, five days into the school year. The next day, Asian students were bombarded with oranges in the cafeteria. Several other students were robbed that month, or beat up. One Chinese student was punched in the left eye while walking through a hallway on Oct. 6. Another student was jumped in a stairwell the following day. During the week before the subway rumble, a Vietnamese student and his friend were jumped by 10 students, on several consecutive days, while walking home from school.
“They don’t even know you,” says Chen, who barely spoke English when he emigrated from China to Philadelphia in January 2007. “They just hit because you’re Asian.”
By Oct. 8, two days after the subway rumble, the Asian students were fed up. Nearly 70 students signed a petition demanding the school take action. They presented the petition to teachers and the principal. Then the Asian students walked out of school.
“We didn’t think that day would be safe,” explains Chen. The students were marked absent. No new safety measures were added. One month later, Asian students were jumped in the ESOL classroom.
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1. Mike L said... on Sep 1, 2009 at 10:45PM
“Those perpetrators should be found and beaten. Racial discrimination should be stamped out. A-hole-ishness and xenophobia should be punished with a nice little lynching though”
2. Anonymous said... on Sep 1, 2009 at 10:51PM
“Wow, how have time change. Black people should be the last group of people you think would attack a minority. They use the racist card when they get treated unfair and then goes around messing with Asian 0-o...
I remember walking home and a bunch of young black kids started to say some ching chong stuff ... Are kids getting dumber? Back when i was in school, kids were too young to discriminated by race... And when high school came along, girls were the primary focus...
Nice job with the new people in charge trying to change things. Im glad the other principals got replace. Parents need to teach their kids better too. This is what happen when kids start having kids.”
3. Anonymous said... on Sep 1, 2009 at 11:57PM
“It is a good thing to read that the School District administrators are taking the problem seriously. But the numbers in the story talk about the total number of incidents that happened in a particular schools (all students no matter the ethnic background) so it might give off the wrong impression that this is a massive problem in all schools citywide.
Since Asian students make up less than 6 percent of the whole student population, the number of assaults have to be far fewer than those impacting African-Americans and other groups.”
4. Anonymous said... on Sep 2, 2009 at 04:42AM
“When I was an elementary and middle school student in South Philadelphia, black students were assaulted by Italians going, during and after school much as Asians are today. At high school in Roxborough, we had to fight the Irish. And during college it was WASP students.
The sad reality is that racial and ethnic discrimination are part of our "less honorable" human condition. This are crimes born of ignorance, fear, lies and resentment.
Unless individuals from these communities show leadership in protecting the rights of these young people to go to school to learn, without fear of injury, I don't believe things can fundamentally change.
In my case, that courageous person was a little old Italian woman who came out of her house, broom in hand, and made the seven boys with sticks and bats stop beating me, and telling them she was going to tell their parents. I am grateful to that woman for protecting me, a complete stranger to her, and I try to follow her example in my life.”
5. Anonymous said... on Sep 2, 2009 at 08:20AM
“Don't make this as a racist issue. Kids are always troublesome, where ever they are. I am an Asian. And I know how people are at school. And how come i didn't see any one bullying me or having a quarrel with me. I saw American students bullying their fellow Americans, you can't just post some thing like that. and if they don't do anything mischievous, then the kid is having trouble.”
6. Anonymous said... on Sep 2, 2009 at 08:52AM
“This is the way it is now, I went to South Phila HS ten years ago and the violence was black on white, black on asian and black on black. My niece is in gradeschool and is harrassed by blacks already racially.
The difference is if it's blacks attacking non-blacks, everyone looks the other way and is afraid of being called a racist.”
7. Anonymous said... on Sep 2, 2009 at 09:14AM
“This is not very strange. I'm an Asian guy as well. I went to school and got into fights nearly everyday. Those Blacks and Hispanic keep picking on Asian. I don't have problem with Whites or other Asian. The Whites just leave you alone, but the really nasty ones are Black and Hispanic. They keep picking on Asian. Especially when I first come to the United States and did not know English at the time. They beat me up everyday until I started to know how to complain to the teachers. Even when I know English, they still pick on Asian and I still got into fights nearly everyday.
The word "racist" used by Black people is over use. They are stupid trouble makers, criminals, arrogant, and hate other group of people. If Whites don't like you, they will just ignore you and leave you alone. The same with Asians. Blacks and Hispanics however likes to beat on people. They can't do anything to Whites so they pick on other races.
Just look at the criminals rate and see who is more civilized.
”
8. Anonymous said... on Sep 2, 2009 at 10:29AM
“This is pathetic for Philadelphia. So first it's African Americans.. now Asians? I don't see anyone trying to fix this.
Myself & another young asian girl got harrased in old city on a Thursday at 7pm by 3 older white men outside of Plough & Stars - pathetic. We were minding our own business. It was a racial harassment. No one does anything about it.”
9. AngeredASIAN... said... on Sep 2, 2009 at 11:08AM
“I think it's absolutely ridiculous that these students are trying to get an education, and these senseless hooligans are attacking them. Is it the asian students fault that, the "Other" kids dont want anything outta life but a police record and 5 or 6 kids they don't take care of? I mean these are the children of the children of the children, Of Urban so-called parents who let there kids run the streets at all hours of the night. Then want to be on the news saying "My son was a good boy who never did any wrong". Im so tired of this. I wish Wilson Goode was Mayor again!!! MOVE”
10. What a disgrace. said... on Sep 2, 2009 at 11:42AM
“I ABSOLUTELY AGREE WITH YOU . I would never want to have kids in Philadelphia - if this is how it's going to be. And the city has done nothing to try to make this better, or even address it!!!!”
11. Grace T said... on Sep 2, 2009 at 01:18PM
“Unfortunately this is a sad reality. The real culprit is ignorance. People need to realize that it is now 2009 almost 2010. The ignorance leads these students to think it is ok for them to lay their hands on another human being. There needs to be education not only in the schools but in the HOME. If anything the proper behavior and respect needs to be exemplified by parents/guardians for these kids to learn.
I was a senior at Temple University and would take the Orange Line to and from my South Philly apartment. One morning I was reading notes for a class and saw a teenage boy smack a teenage girl on the face and run off the train. It seemed as if there were no relations between her and the boy, him and his friends just thought it would be funny. Sadly enough the boy was black and the girl was Asian.
Common respect. Let's learn it and practice it.”
12. Anonymous said... on Sep 2, 2009 at 01:26PM
“is this article supposed to be shocking? the philadelphia public school system is full of violent little savages who prey on the weak. i'm glad PW had the guts to print this article, the liberal media is always so wary of being politically incorrect, of being called racist. but we aren't blind, we know what goes on. animals, nothing more, nothing less.”
13. MKZ said... on Sep 2, 2009 at 01:57PM
“I spent the last two years working at Fels, trying to make things a little bit better, and it was never easy. I'm glad this article illuminated a clear problem in school society, but I am saddened that the situation at Fels and other schools like it was oversimplified.
There are fights every day at Fels, sometimes as many as 8 or 9. Most students I knew at Fels had either feared getting in a fight or considered getting in a fight, no matter their age, gender, race, or ethnicity. The school building was in a state of disrepair, leaking everywhere, with bars on every window, broken glass, peeling paint, and an obvious disregard for the humanity of its students.
There are too many problems at Fels to count. But who is really to blame? Can we blame just the school district, or the employees? I think situations like the one at Fels are our collective responsibility to fix, so everyone, try getting your hands dirty at a school like Fels, then comment on this article.”
14. Anonymous said... on Sep 2, 2009 at 07:35PM
“I've worked with public school children in North Philadelphia, and I'm not at all surprised by the report of such incidents. I hate broaching the subject of race or racism, largely because I don't believe in it. But when you work in an urban school setting where many of the students are black, it's hard to ignore patterns of behavior and speech from a certain group of people that just stand out for their sheer stupidity and complete lack of culture and respect. Let me tell you. I've learned from my experience that the apple doesn't fall far from the tree. Some of these children who display acts of violence don't know any better, because their parents don't know any better - they're just stupid and ignorant. It's a vicious cycle, and no amount of money, or funding or better teachers is going to solve these problems of "urban education". I recall a quote from the article to the effect of "it's a cultural issue." Yes, a lack of real culture among certain students, that is.”
15. Anonymous said... on Sep 2, 2009 at 11:55PM
“We should have an IQ test and then euthanize the bottom 20% of the population and be done with it.
The average convicted felon in the US has an IQ just over 80.
”
16. Anonymous said... on Sep 3, 2009 at 12:33AM
“What shocks me even more than this article are the comments in response. First, some are attributing violence to specific groups, thereby perpetuating racial stereotypes (e.g. "The Whites just leave you alone, but the really nasty ones are Black and Hispanic"). In addition, I can't believe people have the indecency to suggest such horrendous solutions as "an IQ test and then euthanizing the bottom 20% of the population". Before you criticize the failure of the schools and parents, you should reflect on your own flawed thinking, which will serve only to perpetuate these problems of racism and violence.”
17. Anonymous said... on Sep 3, 2009 at 12:43AM
“If an integrated school cannot protect all of its students, namely the most vulnerable of whom are immigrants, than perhaps it would be best to segregate certain school districts. in the case of this article, segregating on race would be a possible solution. elsewhere, where it is less one race against another, segregate based upon performance. students there to learn should be with others like them. students aimed to disrupt and cause violence or threats should be with each other. there is no excuse for violence anywhere, much less school. how dare the public school system subject any of its students to anything less than a safe education.
those causing the problems are themselves uneducated and refuse to be educated. those who are victims are most often in school to learn. so segregate the schools into on for students with a desire for learning and one for those who are violent. why should dedicated students be subjected to fear in the very place they are supposed to learn.”
18. Violent Asian said... on Sep 3, 2009 at 07:00AM
“look, everyone keeps saying the same stuff over and over again about how surprised they are by all this racist sh!t going on. I am an american born Chinese and have seen all sides of it. I have been attacked and been in fights with Whites, Other Asians and Blacks and various other people I couldn't pin-point there race. I've heard the stupid comments and on numerous and even recent occasions been asked the "what country are you from?" or had the backhanded complement "your english is really good" questions and comments thrown at me. So F@ck all of them. Part of the problem is people need to start sticking up for themselves. If the authorities and those supposedly in charge aren't going to help you. Then you need to take the next step "FIGHT BACK!". If your words don't get through to people then you have to protect yourselves buy any means necessary. This at least is one Asian that won't back down!!!!”
19. Anonymous said... on Sep 3, 2009 at 09:24AM
“someone get al sharpton...these asian kids' faces are hurting the black kids' fists.”
20. Anonymous said... on Sep 3, 2009 at 10:29AM
“this is why we have a gang problem in the us”
21. Anonymous said... on Sep 3, 2009 at 10:29AM
“lol @ 22”
22. CLS said... on Sep 3, 2009 at 12:06PM
“...won't be surprised if their is a rise in Asian gangs as a result of this. And the big wheel of of youth-violence and crime will continue to roll.”
23. Anonymous said... on Sep 3, 2009 at 12:16PM
“No one is bringing up the point of the socioeconomic side of things. Fels has been on the list for dangerous schools for seven streak years. This alone signifies the lack of resources either in quality of teachers, books, and/or environment--in this particular chase, maybe a run-down school building.
What is happening here is very similiar to the LA Riots of the 90s, low income individuals fighting for the little resources that are out there. The ESOL students are easy targets as they are perceived as the one trying to "move in on the territory." I'm not saying this is what is going now, but it sure does seems that.”
24. Anonymous said... on Sep 3, 2009 at 01:01PM
“I am a Chinese-American and this really frustrates me. I think the important thing here is to stick together and fight back. One thing that I regret not doing as a high school student was fighting back against the racists that picked on me. If you allow them to pick on you and be scared, then it won't stop. There's a difference between fighting back, and getting hurt, than not fighting back and getting hurt. You have to show the bully that you won't back down.”
25. AngryAsianChick said... on Sep 3, 2009 at 01:18PM
“call 911 more, that's the solution. But schools want to protect their image and will sacrifice students at the expense of saving face.”
26. AngryAsianChick said... on Sep 3, 2009 at 01:18PM
“call 911 more, that's the solution. But schools want to protect their image and will sacrifice students at the expense of saving face.”
27. A Teacher said... on Sep 3, 2009 at 03:31PM
“As a Philadelphia High School teacher at a much safer school than Fels (Where I student-taught), I can tell you that community involvement with an open mind is part of the answer. And it must be more than a hollow challenge to the community. It must be action, not words. The way to raise a generation of students to be responsible members of the community is through the constant push for Volunteerism. (Not mandatory community service; that seems more like a sentence.) There must be a message conveyed of the importance of doing things for the sake of something other than a paycheck. I am an active volunteer, and I can tell you that the work that volunteers do in many different ways and places all over Philadelphia is INCREDIBLE. The only problem is that when weighed against the size of the total population, the amount of people who serve as volunteers is embarrassingly low. To quote JFK, "Ask not what your [city] can do for you; ask what you can do for your [city]."”
28. Educated but mad Asian dude said... on Sep 3, 2009 at 04:08PM
“Racial profiling and targeting is as American as apple pie. When people in charge look the other way, the victims will continue to be harassed time and time again. In a way the school, teachers,etc.. should be held accountable for the vicious beatings and pay for all hospital costs. Any teacher that uses "Yo" as in "Yo Chinese" to call a student needs more education before they can be a teacher. Imagine an Asian teacher going "Yo African or Yo White", he/she would be out of a job at the end of the month why should a black teacher get away with it? So disrespectful!!!”
29. DL said... on Sep 3, 2009 at 04:36PM
“I don't know how Philly is, but this reminds me of how the Bay Area was when I was young. The Asian/Chinese community was large but hadn't expanded to all parts of San Francisco like it is now. I was harassed a lot by non-Asians in the past. However, as time passed and the Chinese live all over SF, I think the incidents occur less and less. Why? Because everyone started to interact with each other. Black, white, Asian and Hispanic kids all play sports and do other things together.
A lot of what is happening in Philly is the same as it has always been (like the article mentions). The older generation of people (non-Asians) see all the Asians coming in and feel they are a "threat" or "taking over". The older generation's biases feed down to the kids, who act out their aggressions on their classmates.”
30. Anonymous said... on Sep 3, 2009 at 10:12PM
“If this happened in rural Texas and black students were being beaten, there would be a national uproar. Minority students being racist, let's call it what it is. I like how the quasi scholar from Yale tries to dismiss this as a turf issue. Just because a particular culture has been discriminated against in the past doesn't give them a free pass with regard to ignorance, violence, and corruption. Unfortunately, as long as race issues in the US are defined on a "black anger/ white fear" axis, no one else will have a voice.”
31. Anonymous said... on Sep 4, 2009 at 04:41AM
“There is too much "trash" in Philadelphia. Please interpret that with as much racial insensitivity/hatred as possible.
”
32. White man in DC said... on Sep 4, 2009 at 08:08AM
“I am waiting for the next Columbine in that school. You poke a dog too much, one day it will bite your ass.
Just like anything else, Jessie and Al are not on this unless when black are victims. The most racist people in America is black people.”
33. Anonymous said... on Sep 4, 2009 at 11:39AM
“I am glad that Philly Weekly and the author of this article, GW Miller, brought attention to the issue of anti-Asian racism which too often is dismissed or ignored. Most people would say there is no anti-Asian bias in this society or they play it down. My only complaint with the article is that it gives the impression that this is mostly about the Asians being immigrants. But you don't see a lot of anti-Jamaican or anti-Carribean attacks, because those groups are mostly blacks. And I wouldn't just focus on kids and students being racist against Asians--society as a whole is. 90% of the time, when you see an Asian on TV or in a movie, he's a villain or an outsider. They're never human beings. Just look at movies like Gran Torino, Crossing Over, Fast and Furious, and Crash--most of the Asians are gang members and criminals, and the only 'good' characters are kids (like in Gran Torino) or weak, helping characters like that guy who gets killed off in F&F Tokyo Drift.”
34. Anonymous said... on Sep 4, 2009 at 11:52AM
“A public education is the right of every American -- native-born or immigrant. But when we tolerate student violence, we are allowing that right to be destroyed by thugs. The right to a public education means NOTHING if students are not protected against violent disruption, as we see here.
School administrators need to adopt a zero-tolerance-for-violence policy. When a student violently attacks another student, the attacker ought to be removed from school and criminally punished. School administrators need to have the courage to protect students from violence -- even if they risk being called racist for doing so. That's a small price to pay for keeping students who want to learn safe.
People of all colors have to stand up and prevent a violent minority from destroying public education for the peaceful majority.
”
35. Alex Wei said... on Sep 4, 2009 at 05:10PM
“These black students must be put in jail for the safety of Chinese business and other Asian Americans. They are career criminals and will forever stay that way. Without the drive to learn or succeed, they are nothing but savage, barbaric beasts that should remain behind prison walls where the majority of them flourish. The Asian American community should not tolerate such dangerous actions from Godless animals without actions. We should teach our kids to defend themselves from such tyranny. In many Asian communities, Blacks rob and vandalize Asian businesses and properties for joy. They have been in this country longer, yet they are less accomplished because they are lazy and immoral by nature. Whether it is the Western or Eastern part of the country, all you hear is Blacks preying on Asians because we refuse to fight back and defend ourselves. THEY COMPLAIN ABOUT RACISM FROM THE ANGELO SAXONS, YET THEY PREY ON US BECAUSE THE HAVE NO MOTIVE IN LIFE BESIDES A LIFE OF CRIME.”
36. Anonymous said... on Sep 4, 2009 at 06:14PM
“this is a culturally based issue. these are young ignorant kids who dont get it, are raised in racist families, and develop prejudices because of peer influence and pressure, they are social outcasts who feel alone without a group to belong in so they look towards racial differences to separate themselves and to define themselves.
we have to encourage individual growth instead of all the institutional shit thats going on”
37. said... on Sep 4, 2009 at 07:04PM
“鸡蛋里挑骨头 – Picking at bones in a chicken egg – Seeing things that aren’t there”
38. mute said... on Sep 4, 2009 at 09:44PM
“Depressing article. Depressing comments. Wish I could say I was surprised to see some of the ugly comments about black kids and public school students, but that's the internet for you.
Nevertheless, I am upset to hear about the racist abuse that Asian students are receiving in South Philly High and other schools. Reading how the teacher called for one of the students as "Yo Chinese" is also pretty damn appalling. While I understand the focus of the article is on the Asian students, it would have been interesting if G. W. Miller had been able to get into contact with some of the bullies or their parents and see if he could get them to explain why they thought this behavior was okay. Are these kids that have only attacked Asian students? Are they just violent students in general and Asian students are just one of the many people on the receiving ends of their violence?
Hopefully there's still opportunities in Philly schools to foster positive relationships between our groups.”
39. Anonymous said... on Sep 4, 2009 at 10:30PM
“For all the hateful/ dehumanizing/ racist/ offensive comments: such thinking is part of this very problem of hate. The PW article itself is racially polarizing by turning this into an issue that is between Asians and Blacks, when in fact White children were also attacking Asian students. The children who were attacked and the children who did the attacking have one important thing in common: they are children. These children are being educated in schools with a lack of resources and accountability. If we think of all children as our own, then instead of blaming a “scapegoat”, we would take action. Such violence isn't just the problem of the children’s parents, the school, law enforcement; it's the problem of every citizen because these children are the future, and if we don't invest our time in them now then we will only help the problem persevere. Let’s get involved in our communities and make a difference!”
40. JewishLeftist said... on Sep 4, 2009 at 11:32PM
“I think this article deserves zero stars, and if I was allowed to, I'd rate it as such. There are incidents of black-on-asian racism, but also incidents of cross-ethnic violence everywhere in Philly and the nation. The article fails to discuss how Asians themselves might be racist, provoking African-Americans to fight back. For example, for about 20 years now, Asians have taken away seats from blacks at high-ranking universities, unfairly I might add. Not only that, it doesn't discuss white attacks against Asians. This is unfortunate racist-fascist agitrprop which is seeking to side with the "light-skinned, better-off" Asians (which the author seemingly sees as more fit) and demonize the "dark-skinned, lower-middle-class" African-Americans. Moreover, the article has invited all sorts of racist comments about how African-Americans are criminals. This is not true, and has been debunked by scientists over the yea”
41. JewishLeftist said... on Sep 4, 2009 at 11:33PM
“To continue my previous comment,
The next time you read about an African American or Hispanic who committed a crime, don't blame the African American or Hispanic, instead blame the majority white population. Whites have historically oppressed people-of-color; this has been occurring for hundreds of years. Oppressed people have limited opportunity for education, employment, promotion, advancement, etc. Such oppression unfortunately manifests itself in the form of violent crime. Ultimately, whites are responsible for such crime.”
42. violentasian said... on Sep 5, 2009 at 07:42AM
“Let me guess JewishLeftist Description: "white kid from the suburbs with Dreads mist likely from Jersey who has decided to move to the city because of there cultural awareness", "maybe Walks around with his dirty squatter friends at free Mumia protests chanting "Mumia Burns, Philly Burns!". Been Around a long time and seen them all come and go. you have some serious "White Guilt" going on. Granted, I am making a d!ckhead comment. but the article was only pointing out examples and facts. And you do like to call blacks poor and lower class.”
43. Anonymous said... on Sep 5, 2009 at 09:42AM
“Man there's some craziness going on this post. Racist rants here only make the situation worse people.
To correct JewishLeftist, Asian students aren't taking seats away from blacks at upper tier universities. Actually, Jewish people are the most overrepresented in upper tier universities with respect to the US population. Jewish people (great people, great culture by the way) can blend in if they want to. They are caucasian when it is convenient and minorities when they need to be. Most ivy league universities have a quota on the limit of Asian students they will take. This is real and racist. No such quota for Jews (though there was back in the day and that was wrong as well). The rest of the minorities have to fight it out for those "token" spots.”
44. JewishLeftist said... on Sep 5, 2009 at 11:06AM
“Actually, both whites and asians are overrepresented. At Temple for example, which is taxpayer funded, only 15% of the student population is African-American, whereas locally African-Americans make up almost 45% of the population, and non-Hispanic whites make up only 39.4% of the population. But whites are still the dominating group at Temple. Asians make up only about 4% of the local population, but are 10% of the student population. So, taking into account local demographics, Whites and Asians are both overrepresented by a factor of two. If you go to places like UPenn and Drexel, that number is only going to increase.”
45. JewishLeftist said... on Sep 5, 2009 at 11:06AM
“Actually, both whites and asians are overrepresented. At Temple for example, which is taxpayer funded, only 15% of the student population is African-American, whereas locally African-Americans make up almost 45% of the population, and non-Hispanic whites make up only 39.4% of the population. But whites are still the dominating group at Temple. Asians make up only about 4% of the local population, but are 10% of the student population. So, taking into account local demographics, Whites and Asians are both overrepresented by a factor of two. If you go to places like UPenn and Drexel, that number is only going to increase.”
46. JewishLeftist said... on Sep 5, 2009 at 11:06AM
“Actually, both whites and asians are overrepresented. At Temple for example, which is taxpayer funded, only 15% of the student population is African-American, whereas locally African-Americans make up almost 45% of the population, and non-Hispanic whites make up only 39.4% of the population. But whites are still the dominating group at Temple. Asians make up only about 4% of the local population, but are 10% of the student population. So, taking into account local demographics, Whites and Asians are both overrepresented by a factor of two. If you go to places like UPenn and Drexel, that number is only going to increase.”
47. Pen said... on Sep 5, 2009 at 01:26PM
“JewishLeftist, you're right that Asian Americans are overrepresented in higher education and that as an overall racial group, their SES (socioeconomic status) is higher than the average American.
However, I don't think the violence described in this article is the result of a conscious effort or frustration of socioeconomic difference/inequality. The Asian Americans attacked in these situations are often as poor, if not poorer, as their white and black counterparts (thus living in the same neighborhood and going to the same schools). There are significant social class differences within the Asian American community.
The Asian American community in South Philadelphia faces a myriad of social problems far from the middle-upper class backgrounds of many of the students at UPenn and like universities. As an Asian American born and raised in South Philadelphia who moved to Boston as a young adult, I can personally testify to the stark contrast.”
48. Pen said... on Sep 5, 2009 at 01:40PM
“(cont...)
I think the problem of anti-Asian violence in Philadelphia is rooted in two things: 1) Asian Americans living in an neighborhoods with high rates of violence irregardless of race and 2) xenophobia. I agree with some observers that getting harassed and assaulted isn't an exclusive to Asian Americans in Philadelphia. The rate of black-on-black violence, for example, is a horrific and perpetual problem. But that doesn't mean that Asian Americans aren't being singled out and aren't deserving of particular attention.
I want to point out a contradiction in attempts to identify the causation of anti-Asian violence: we are stereotyped as quiet people yet the provocateurs of street violence. If there is frustration stemming from perceived socioeconomic difference and inequalities, I don't think violence is the way to express it nor does it solve anything.”
49. Anonymous said... on Sep 6, 2009 at 06:05PM
“OK with comments like that you lot need help, and you should be thrown into jail as well (arseholes). In general you asians are a closed community, and you have problems anywhere you go because of your attitudes, which I personally think is the reason why (not that I am condoning the bullying) this is happening I have read the history of the LA riots and if you immigrate to a poor community and you don't try to assimilate, you will have problems in places like, i Don't know school!
Bullying is part of growing up if you experienced racism or bullying by a particular community deal with it or leave. I think this article is biased and is making this a racial issue when it is about kids in a poor school bullying (by all races).I could start calling asians names with the comments I've read but I won't stoop your level. What you are doing is also bullying. DON'T STEREOPTYPE AN ENTIRE RACE OF PEOPLE BECAUSE OF A BAD EXPERIENCE SHOWS HOW UNINTELLIGENT YOU ARE.”
50. Doug said... on Sep 8, 2009 at 11:07AM
“Alex Wei You sound just as ignorant and stupid as any racist I have run across. Think before you type.”
51. Anonymous said... on Sep 8, 2009 at 12:44PM
“@50
Asians are under no requirement to make any changes in their culture or how they live to "assimilate" into "your" neighborhoods. Asian immigrants, particularly in Philadelphia, have consistently shown an ability to overcome language, cultural and class barriers to become productive members of society.
South Philly was a dying shithole before the Vietnamese came in the 70s, they (and the other South East Asians later) turned a lot of neighborhoods that most had given up on around. I live in an Irish neighborhood and we should be so lucky to have Chinese immigrant neighbors. They're well mannered, bring businesses and clean. Who gives a shit if they're a "closed community"?
What's an "open community"? A community that beats up kids for doing well in school, a community that wantonly mugs people, that thinks the streets are trash cans, that beats their kids in stores, that screams profanity and blasts music at all hours of the night? I think we all know what community that is.”
52. Anonymous said... on Sep 8, 2009 at 02:38PM
“No we don't, why don't you enlighten us? Like (commentor 50) said If you don't ike your neigbourhood leave and no nobody said that asians are under any obligation to assimilate no community is. But if you are an immigrant it is a good idea to to try and get along with people in your community be they black or white. Honestly no one is condoning this, but if they are being targeted say something but don't point the finger at a race of people it shows how racist you really are.. WTF are you talking about beating kids for doing well and all that bullshit. You seem to think you know alot about the black community, but then what should I expect you're Asian.”
53. Pen said... on Sep 8, 2009 at 06:57PM
“@53 - none of the asian americans interviewed in this article ever singled out black people. did you even read it? the author of the article documented incidents and noted the races of victim and perpetrators.
troll.”
54. cn2004 said... on Sep 9, 2009 at 11:37AM
“hey jewishleftist, i know absolutely nothing about you except for one thing. you've never set foot in a black neighborhood. every comment about blacks and their criminal and violent behavior is called racist. but it's never called untrue.”
55. Anonymous said... on Sep 9, 2009 at 04:25PM
“When I complained about being a victim of verbal abuse/racism to my father, he told me of an incident in Beijing 20 years ago. When my dad first went there as a graudate student, there were a few times on the bus when a beijing local would look down on my dad because of his non-beijing accent and tell him to go back to the farm where he came from.
my dad told me of another story of some hooligans who were taunting and beating other random students up in his middle school in china. The leader of the bunch was a son of a local wealthy businessman, so no one dared fight back. One of the class leaders, a popular and academically talented kid, organized the entire class to trick the head of this bunch to go to the class alone. The guy showed up, and the mob descended upon the guy and beat him to a pulp. The kid was paralyzed for the rest of his life. The police half heartedly tried to find out who the perpetrators were, but no one said talked.
the masses will fight back.”
56. Karen Johnson said... on Sep 9, 2009 at 05:06PM
“At the turn of the 20th century famed scholar WEB Dubois wrote the prophetic statement, “The problem of the twentieth century is the problem of the color-line,--the relation of the darker to the lighter races of men in Asia and Africa, in America and the islands of the sea.” He later indicated that his statement should be understood beyond the narrow confines of color/race/culture and rather, should be applied to all forms “human hate and prejudice” perpetrated across groups. Approximately 100 years later, the profound truth of DuBois’ words reverberates across the globe and the enmity it points to daily scorches the hearts and minds of men and women, boys and girls. We have all been hurt by racism, along with a plethora of other "isms", and the ultimate incorrect response to this type of pain is to castigate an entire group.”
57. Karen Johnson said... on Sep 9, 2009 at 05:07PM
“A careful study of every group's history --- Native Americans, Jews, Africans, individuals living in the African Diaspora, Asians, Serbians, the Irish, Bosnians, Palestinians to name just a few --- reveals unspeakable crimes being perpetrated within and across groups. Should I dismiss an entire group of Asians because of the recent atrocities committed by Jiverly Wong, the individual who shot 13 people in Binghamton, NY at an immigration services center before taking his own life? The most obvious answer is no. The same can be said of every other group. Rather than pointing accusing fingers (which ultimately further alienates and divides), perhaps a more meaningful response might be to recognize that people of every hue, language, cultural background, and socioeconomic status are capable of inflicting tremendous pain. We are all also capable of incredible good.”
58. Karen Johnson said... on Sep 9, 2009 at 05:08PM
“Please do not misunderstand my statements. I do not mean to ignore the very real pain that motivated some of the more emotion-laden reactions to this article. As a social worker, I recognize that the angry comments are prompted in part by pain. While honoring your pain however, as well as the pain that I too have experienced at the hands of racism, my commitment to myself and to the world --- those who look like me and those who do not, is to recognize that we are all capable of extraordinary ‘good’ and ‘bad’. I also commit to doing my absolute best to understand, and then work to undermine, the forces that constrain the potential for good we all inherently possess.”
59. Pen said... on Sep 9, 2009 at 07:05PM
“@Karen: I respect your compassion and sincerity. I also agree that all human beings are capable and having demonstrated an ability to act violently. I'm Asian American and have been threatened and bullied by people of all races (including other Asian Americans). I have also experienced amazing acts of compassion and love from people of all races (including blacks and other Asian Americans).
However, I think we must remain statistically honest about how and where violence occurs in a particular situation to effectively solve it. By addressing and acknowledging the fact that Asian American youth are perpetually targeted for bullying by black youth in South Philadelphia does not mean that I am saying that this does or will occur in every context. I am framing a problem by identifying where it is occurring, identifying the individuals and groups, the nature of their relationship(s), and analyzing the rate and nature of violence in a particular space and time.”
60. Pen said... on Sep 9, 2009 at 07:22PM
“(cont...)
At the moment, we are addressing anti-Asian violence in South Philadelphia. It seems to occur where black youth are instigating violence and taunting toward Asian American youth at a much higher rate than the other way around. This does that mean that I am generalizing black youth nor Asian American youth. I am addressing and acknowledging reality of race and youth relations in South Philadelphia.
Let us not trivialize a serious problem for the sake of vengeance or peace. Rather, we must struggle to build a peaceful and healthier community for everyone (regardless of race or class), but with honesty evaluation, communication and acknowledgment.”
61. Pen said... on Sep 9, 2009 at 08:08PM
“"This does that mean that I am generalizing black youth nor Asian American youth" is meant to say
"This does not mean that I am generalizing black youth nor Asian American youth.”
62. glad i moved said... on Sep 9, 2009 at 11:11PM
“my mom's friend's husband, a 60 yr old asian man was beaten by a random group of teens on a SUNDAY AFTERNOON in n. 5th st. he wasn't a small guy, so he fought back and held onto a girl till the cops came. the girl's mom was a cop, who took her away, that was that. he was sent home.he talked to a lawyer, but found he couldn't do anything w/o the minority community leader, who was abroad at that time. he's probably back now, but the person i speak of is now fed up. we're all struggling, we dont need all this bs stress.unlike Pen,i AM generalizing, and stereotyping the black youth of philly,the majority of them atleast.they'll hate on u no matter how old you are.why do you think every 1st generation asian immigrant is afraid of black ppl?how long ago did they immigrate, yet they still feel that way.it's been going on since they've been here.I can't count with my own fingers how many elderly asians i PERSONALLY know that have been robbed/beaten by blacks.city of brotherly love?bullsh*t”
63. Pen said... on Sep 11, 2009 at 01:44PM
“@"glad i moved said"
I have had the same experiences, too, as well as my family. I personally know it is extremely hard to talk about, or even imagine, peace when you are living where all the violence is happening. I know that, realistically, that it is a hard sell to ask people to forgive and work together when the bullying continues.
But I know that this problem is not new and the attempts to "fight fire with fire" never changed anything. I grew up with the Asian gangs in Philadelphia and that phenomenon, meant to protect Asian youth from non-Asian youth, ended up creating a culture where Asians were/are killing Asians. Moving out of the city didn't change anything either except leave the remaining families more vulnerable.
We must continue to focus on friendship between all communities in South Philadelphia. I'm not saying that it's easy - perhaps far from it. There is no easy solution nor am I clear of the "best" plan but I know that more violence and hate is the worst plan.”
64. Americanized said... on Sep 12, 2009 at 06:47AM
“This is a very ugly article, but brutally true. In my school experience, by far the worst most violent racist was a black kid. The white kids were also racist, but theirs was playful and mocking, but never evil like the black kid's racism. Norman Podhoretz had a great essay many years ago titled, "my negro problem and ours" which mirrors what many asian kids go through (btw Jewishleftist, suck it, affirmative action policies take away seats from asian kids, who have the double whammy of being discriminated against in society and by AA policies).
In my opinion, whites aren't comfortable, for good reason, of vilifying blacks, hence the author's assertion that the students were reluctant to finger blacks as the culprit. Blacks tend to wallow in self-pity over their current state and the Atlantic Passage. We all know that the worst bullies are the self-pitying ones.
While causation is not correlation, when it's your personal well-being at stake, subtleties are a luxury.”
65. lolwat said... on Sep 12, 2009 at 07:05AM
“These black animals must be stopped.”
66. King of Ruckus said... on Sep 12, 2009 at 10:25PM
“chinkies and turd-skinned indians in the VIP room. YNY!”
67. Pen said... on Sep 13, 2009 at 09:33PM
“@Americanized
Thanks for the Podheretz article. It is, amazingly, honest and relevant today. The experiences he describes are strikingly similar to the stories of inner-city Asian Americans in poverty.
I also agree with his conclusion that interracial marriage, is the best solution, as it is perhaps the most intimate form of bringing families and communities together. However, I'm against marriage as political strategy and would hope that couples are finding themselves in sincere love.”
68. silverbullet said... on Sep 15, 2009 at 07:55AM
“If it wasn't race the kids would be beating each other up over something else. The problem is you have massive groups of violent kids all in one school.
Give them all an IQ test and some sort of "violence test" and move the smart, level headed kids to a different school so this bullshit doesn't mess up their life. Let the hot headed morons beat eachother into oblivion, half of them will be dead in 10 years anyway.”
69. silverbullet said... on Sep 15, 2009 at 08:00AM
“Or- have a zero tolerance policy towards violence. Kick the violent students out of school for good.
Cut the schools in half, take the leftover money and KEEP THE DAMN LIBRARIES OPEN so people who want to learn have the resources they need, instead of wasting money on people who come to school to fight.”
70. Anonymous said... on Sep 15, 2009 at 01:58PM
“its sad, but America was built on BS like this happening. The same thing happened to the Irish when they became "americanized", they were treated like the blacks at first. Then the puritan-angelo saxons began to accept them because hey, "at least they are white". In short, the Irish felt like they had to treat black people like their fellow caucasian brothers. I think this situation sounds very similiar.”
71. americanized said... on Sep 16, 2009 at 06:37AM
“The most outrageous aspect of this article is how it goes out of its way to avoid stating the obvious: the blacks are targeting the asians for racial reasons, thus causing a variety of social problems among the targeted. This after all is the same paper that employs a columnist who stated that he moved from a midwestern college town to Philadelphia for the sole reason so as he could be closer to black people -- such a blithely STUPID liberal sentiment (and yes, I voted for Obama)
Anyways, the "expert" in this case is a black sociologist prof who is undoubtedly already biased in favor of the black kids, and so tries to ameliorate the role of the black persecutors. Why not ask a psychologist about the negative effects this will have on the asian kid's long-term development? but of course, it's a white paper unaccustomed to portrayals of blacks outside of its preconceived conception of them as noble victims, amplified by the fact that for white america...asians aren't that sympathetic.”
72. will-to-flower said... on Sep 16, 2009 at 01:13PM
“These poor Asian kids are like hostages in these zoo schools. My heart goes out to them. One hopes they will use these horrendous experiences as motivation to succeed in life so their kids don't have to go through the same thing. P.S. If these were white thugs doing this to blacks, this newspaper would have NO problem identifying the racial character of the violence and intimidation.”
73. Americanized said... on Sep 16, 2009 at 03:29PM
“Furthermore, yes, a large part of the intimidation is about territory and outsiders coming in. The way it's worded by the black sociology prof. he makes it sound like the asians are invading black territory and the black kids are doing the natural thing in reacting against them.
Well, sorry, but you could break down the history of white racism against black people in exactly the same terms: xenophobia, provincialism, territory, etc. If this isn't racism, then racism doesn't exist. In any case, this is the real reason people move away to the safety of the suburbs. It's not about bigotry -- it's about personal well-being.”
74. Ray said... on Sep 17, 2009 at 04:25AM
“Asian students being assaulted should not be treated solely as a social problem, but as a criminal problem. Superintendent Silverman, what you have is not "really an interesting case study". What you have is "really an emergency". When children are having their necks and faces broken, you don't have time to "build a consensus". If I were you, I would hire an undercover security force to trail some well protected Asian decoys. When the young thugs are captured, they should be locked up in juvenile centers to learn Reading, Writing, Arithmetic, and Respect. Only when they turn eighteen and are reformed should they be released. The teens remaining at school will be able to learn in safety and peace. Principal Brown, we can "celebrate our differences" until we become giddy and drop. But at the same time it should be made perfectly clear that if you're not with the program, violent acts mean you will lose your freedom. And finally to Mr. Anderson, the academic from Yale: This group violence is not "a human thing". It's an animal thing. As I gather from the cable news channels you have your own security problem at Yale to take care of.
”
75. Existing said... on Sep 17, 2009 at 09:02PM
“America is advanced in many aspects socially compared to most of the world, but sadly human nature makes every society very visual.
I am an Asian-American female who has lived in Philadelphia my whole life. I have been ill-treated for no reason by Blacks, Whites, Hispanics and even other Asians. Despite such hate towards me for just Existing, I would like to think I am still a very ideal person and I believe with all my heart that every person should be treated with respect when shown respect.
It makes me very distraught that Racism is an active part of many of our lives whether we're Asian, Black, White, or Hispanic.
I am a firm advocate of the power of education, where tolerance and self-respect can be incorporated in the curriculum at a very young age and throughout your academic career. It won't solve racism but it's a step towards a positive direction. Change doesn't happen overnight.”
76. Anonymous said... on Sep 20, 2009 at 07:21PM
“Yeah Bro' it's just the "culture" right? Wasn't too long ago that Lynching. beatings, and being attacked by police dogs was part of the "culture". You are dealing with people who venerate ignorance and violence and blame everyone else for their situation. Of course they really don't commit 98o/o of
street crime, it's a lie put out there by "the man".”
77. Pen said... on Sep 21, 2009 at 03:11PM
“Another thing to note is the relationship between first and second generation African immigrants and African Americans with ancestry in American slavery. There is sometimes good relationship between the two communities as they share a common ancestry and some similar experiences. But there has also been horrible relations between the two groups.
African immigrant youth who do not culturally "assimilate" into African American communities are also the target of bullying and violence by African American youth. I've heard African American 'scholars' blame African immigrants for being "isolationist" and judgmental of African Americans as a reason why African American youth bully African immigrant youth.
But as Asian American youth, African immigrant youth from certain countries are stereotypically seen as studious and quiet. It's interesting to see, despite the same 'phenotype' of Af Am youth, being treated the same way as Asian American youth by Af Am youth.”
78. Anonymous said... on Sep 24, 2009 at 04:02AM
“These things happens everywhere, like pakistans and India, black on black, white on white and so on. I think in my opinion is that why the blacks pick on Asians are because they look weak, quiet, keep things to themselves and/or don't know much English. Or maybe because in their eye, they are just funny looking because of their looks, but I am confused because most of the time, I see Chinese people being bullied more then any other Asians like Vietnam and vietnamese and Cambodian people, i even see Cambodian people pick or robbed Chinese people. Do these Cambodian look at the Chinese like black people ? Were they raised like them, stereotyping chinese? All I know from my knowledge is that this is like a cycle of some sort, being Americans and having to face many challenges throughout life.......
Please excuse my english grammers, thank you
”
79. Pen said... on Sep 28, 2009 at 07:11PM
“Article on conflict between African immigrants and African American youth in Southwest Philly: http://www.thenotebook.org/fall-2008/087/student-ambassadors-tackle-divide-between-africans-african-americans
”
80. Anonymous said... on Sep 28, 2009 at 07:21PM
“This is why you can't have public schools. I say we disband the Department of Education and refund everyone their tax money. There will be obvious demand for education, so new, better private schools will be started driving costs down and quality up. Best of all, parents can be assured that if they send their child to these sorts of schools they won't be dealing with riff raff that don't want to learn and want to disrupt the advancement of others.”
81. Anonymous said... on Oct 7, 2009 at 11:07AM
“At the end of the day, it's not too much about race but working class kids fighting each other for limited resources. You won't see a lot fights in schools with adequate teachers. Reach out to the kids or the community organizations they are affiliated with, be their resources, and connect them to other resources.”
82. Hizzo said... on Oct 9, 2009 at 03:40AM
“Its funny when its a group of black kids beating on asian kids its not about race, but when its white kids beating on black kids its racist. Respect for other people should be taught at home not at school. If I got assualted I'd press charges on the kid and his/her mom, cause I know daddy ain't there. @FakeJewtotheleft:"Asians themselves might be racist, provoking African-Americans to fight back" Are you serious?
@Pen:Thanks for the 15 bucks”
83. Anonymous said... on Oct 9, 2009 at 10:34PM
“What it boils down to is ignorance. If its not one crime against one person its another.Society is making it look ok to beat or cause harm to others. I hate it for the people who come here and the first thing they witness about america is violence over such a stupid thing as race or difference. In my opinion blacks and hispanics should be the last people trying to discriminate considering all the violence we dealt with in the past its nothing but a on going circle.”
84. Anonymous said... on Oct 21, 2009 at 10:38AM
“to Jewish Leftist's comment: Asians themselves might be racist, provoking African-Americans to fight back.
Have you noticed you just stereotyped the whole Asian population? As a Jew, you should know this is wrong and dangerous.”
85. Anonymous said... on Oct 21, 2009 at 10:47AM
“to other Angry Asians:
It is painful to see the youth going through what we had gone or sometimes are still going through. But some of the comments you made will not help to ease the situation. In fact, they will bring more resentment and retaliation. Think of a more constructive way to express yourself and get involved so the kids can get some help.”
86. 2u-all said... on Nov 10, 2009 at 01:21PM
“i think we all should go back to where we come from and ask the Native American to come back home...We come here to make a better live instead we are destroying each other. this society or this life style even the system in America is not appropriate any more for the foreigners...Let us go home and be at peace.”